Michael McDonald

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that was starting to sell in Ireland
and that we should look at him.
That’s how the whole process
started.
Michael McDonald
Who were the major investors
in the startup?
ATO Records
Chris: We were pretty fortunate
T
to have David Gray’s White Ladder
as our first release. Coran and
Dave put up some money, which
probably got us through four
or five months before we were
self-sufficient.
his isn’t just an interview with ATO President
Michael McDonald. Joining in is his partner,
Chris Tetzeli, who happened to be in New York City
during the phone call. Tetzeli has been a longtime
employee of Coran Capshaw’s Red
Light Management, whose most
important client is the Dave
Matthews Band.
ATO is the brainchild of
Matthews, along with the two head
honchos and Capshaw. The roster
is a small but powerful one, with
a high percentage of the artists
already gracing Pollstar’s cover,
and probably more on the way.
Matthews thought of the full title
– “According To Our Records” –
between 1999 and 2000, and they
signed David Gray to the label just as
his White Ladder was taking to the
charts in the U.K. It was a successful
start, and the label has continued to
make tracks in the right direction.
As promoter Geoff Gordon
told Pollstar, the label has a good
long-term focus, represented best
by My Morning Jacket, which is
making a slow but steady build.
There’s also the splashy newcomer
Jem plus Ben Kweller, Gov’t Mule,
Warren Haynes, North Mississippi
Allstars, Patti Griffin and South
Africa’s Vusi Mahlasela.
McDonald was nominated for
Pollstar’s Concert Industry Award
for Record Executive of the Year
in 2003, yet he was somewhat of an
enigma to us. It turned out that was
because his history is not in the
record biz, but in everything else.
For one thing, he manages John
Mayer. He recently took on the same
role for Ray Lamontagne, whom we
will be hearing about a lot in the
years to come.
Returning from a brief business
trip to London, McDonald sat
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2004-2005 Edition
down for the interview in the New
York City office; Tetzeli happened
to be visiting from Charlottesville,
Va., and was happy to join in.
What are your backgrounds
and how did the record
company get formed?
Michael: I think they’re pretty tied
in with each other. I was two years
out of college and playing in a
band when I was introduced to
Dave Matthews Band through producer John Alagia. We were living
in D.C. at the time. We both fell in
love with the band and would go
see them in Virginia every week.
John got the gig to record
their first release, which was a
live album up in Nantucket, and
brought me in to do the grunt
work, run cables, whatever.
I got to know the band there
over the course of three days. It
was the end of summer and their
T-shirt person, Alex Stultz, who
is still with them today, had to go
back to school to finish college.
So, I took his place on the road,
initially selling T-shirts, then guitar teching, then tour managing for
the majority of what was about six
years, up until I left the road and
began working on the label. We
formed ATO in the second half of
1999, started setting up the David
Gray album in December and
January 2000, then released Gray’s
White Ladder in March 2000.
I started getting involved in
artist management about mid2000, working with John Mayer.
Chris: I started working with
Coran Capshaw in ’93, just sort
of helping him full time, 24/7, with
Dave Matthews Band. Coran had
retained as much control of the
band’s career as possible every step
of the way, so by the time we got to
’99, we found ourselves distributing records, working directly with
radio stations, just taking as involved of an approach as possible.
In ’99, Coran and I were in
Virginia and started talking about
a record company. Basically, we had
the experience and somewhat of
the infrastructure of a record label
and, at the same time, Michael and
Dave were having a discussion on
the road. Michael was still out as the
band’s road manager at that point.
We came together and realized
we had an opportunity to do something. We didn’t have a grand
vision at the time – more of a
simple approach to use the
infrastructure and experience
to get behind some music we felt
passionate about and sell some
records.
Michael: Oddly enough, in talking
about it and forming the label,
the name we used as a placeholder
was David Gray, someone we felt
had an amazing talent and who
had just never gotten the chance or
the focus from any of the releases
he had. We just used him as an
example of the type of artist we
wanted to work with and, lo and
behold, Dave Matthews’ publicist
at the time, Ambrosia Healy,
mentioned to Dave that Gray
didn’t have a label, had this record
So, the budget got refilled
quickly.
Chris: Yeah. We thought it was
a pretty easy business (laughing).
It was like, “What’s everybody
complaining about?”
What’s ATO’s business
philosophy?
Michael: There is no sort of a sign-
ing schedule, no long-term huge
plan. When something comes
along that we feel incredibly
passionate about and believe in,
we want to be in a position to sign
and do the job we need to do to
get it exposed.
Our roster has come to us
from a million different sources,
so there’s not really one avenue
we look for artists from. We’ve
always believed in keeping things
very small. That way, we learn
how much focus and attention
somebody needs to get off the
ground and become successful.
I think we’re just trying to stay
true to what we’ve learned and not
overexpand.
Considering your backgrounds
in management and touring,
were there surprises starting up
ATO or did you feel prepared?
Chris: There were a lot of
surprises. I think the nice thing
is Michael and I worked together
while he was on the road and
I was at the management office,
so we had a great relationship,
more personally than professionally.
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But by working on projects
together throughout that six-year
period while DMB was growing
exponentially, we found that our
experiences complemented each
other. We had a different set of
skills that worked really well for
us as we started ATO.
Still, in terms of working
at a record label, we learned a
ton in the first couple years.
We identified very clearly the
relationships that needed to be
nurtured and the places we really
needed to delve into and develop,
such things as figuring out radio
promotion.
We spent a lot of time with our
distributor, BMG Distribution.
From a management standpoint,
we didn’t work with them as
closely as we did with ATO
Records, but it’s funny: both jobs
relied on each other and now
comes along with tour-managing
a band. I don’t think it was until
I started working on the label
that I realized how many releases
are out there and how many
songs are vying for so few spots
on the radio.
You realize in black and white
how competitive it is and I think,
through our success with David
Gray, you realize how much focus
and time and repetition it takes
to get something on people’s
radar. There’s a lot of music out
there and just getting someone to
listen to a record takes time. But
I think we learned it, and I think
we’ve learned it fairly quickly.
Chris: I think there’s also a
beauty in not knowing everything, in the same way as
managing Dave Matthews Band
out of Charlottesville, Va.
Coran did
an amazing
job of just figuring things
out and doing
them the way
he thought
made sense,
and not
necessarily
adhering to
the industry
norm. He
did what he
thought was
right for the
band.
CHRIS AND MICHAEL wrap their arms around Vusi M
Maahl a se
sella ,
In similar
B en K
wel le r and My Morning Jacket’s Jim JJaam es at NYC’s Joe’s
Kw
fashion, in
Pub last year during the CMJ/ATO Records showcase.
starting ATO
we got to
I’m positive as managers, we’re
research and learn things, then
much more aware of the imporgot to figure out how to do things
tance of the distribution comwe thought worked.
pany and how important that
We were small enough to be
relationship is to your managenimble and creative.
ment client.
It was indispensable with
Your backgrounds in touring
David Gray. BMG was just
and management help you find
phenomenal for us.
Michael: And, as you get into it,
I think you just learn the scope
of everything.
Certainly, my experience on
the road made me focus on one
band and doing everything that
solutions to the impossible.
Sounds like a good skill to
have in the record biz.
Michael: Yeah, I think what has
happened over time is we got a
collective pool of experiences,
whether it’s on the management
or the label side, that really
help us get around problems.
Invariably, someone whom we
work with has probably been
through the same situation that
we were in at X-period and found
a way around it.
Have you stayed in the
same office this whole time?
Michael: No, it actually started
in my living room in New York
and Chris in his office in
Charlottesville. Then we stepped
up to my bedroom.
Then, we actually moved
into Marty Diamond’s old offices
on Gramercy Park (New York),
which is a two-room office with
a little bathroom and kitchen
so Chris could stay there when
he came up. Then we moved
here to Chambers Street, and
we share space with Big Hassle
publicity. We’ve been here
a little over two-and-a-half
years.
Chris: In New York, there are
six of us, and three of us in
Charlottesville full-time. And as
many interns as we can find.
Does your staff have titles
like a major has, such as
“A&R Rep?”
Michael: We have some, but just
being this small, titles obviously
overlap a tremendous amount.
John Biondolillo is our label
manager and he product manages most everything. Melissa
Rich, who actually used to work
at BMG, is our head of sales, and
I’m sure BMG is happy to have
someone who knows the systems
involved. I’m sure it was a nightmare dealing with us during our
first release.
Everyone answers the phones
and the work sort of gets spread
throughout all of us. Generally,
Chris and I each will take a
project, so I have about half
the roster, he has about half the
roster. We’ll each oversee about
three or four things depending
on what’s active.
Chris: The management company
has been run out of Charlottesville for a while and the amount
of people who work out of there
just naturally started growing.
We have a few people in
Charlottesville we kind of share
between ATO and Red Light
Management.
We’ve got head of promotion,
Nick Attaway. Again, we’re not
much for titles but Patrick Jordan
is sort of the head of our marketing, a great guy who came from
BMG as well, where he was head
of alternative marketing.
Also, Bruce Flohr was the A&R
man for Dave Matthews Band
and Foo Fighters at RCA, and
worked there for about 15 years.
He’s a huge resource for us.
He spends a lot of time with
DMB but he’s always there for
marketing ideas and a great
source for A&R.
Michael: He’s been particularly
active with Jem.
Let’s talk a bit about Jem.
She’s one of your newest
signings.
Michael: Jem is a Welsh
songwriter/performer/DJ/
producer who was visiting in L.A.
when she listened to KCRW. She
didn’t know what [the format]
was but she knew it was amazing
and had a friend drive her over
to the station.
She left her demos with
Nic Harcourt, who was out
of town. He started playing her
demos. This was actually when
Bruce (Flohr) was moving to
Charlottesville; he heard her,
brought her to our attention
and we basically fell in love with
her and her music and signed
her to ATO.
Bruce has stayed incredibly
involved with the marketing
of the record and, going back
to our lack of job descriptions,
he’s just been part of the team
that’s making it happen.
As we grow and more people
are brought into the mix, Bruce
has slowly become involved with
2004-2005 Edition
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EXECUTIVE INTERVIEW
DAVE MATTHEWS snaps a photo with
Maahla se
sella , the South African star
Vusi M
that Matthews wanted on ATO.
all of our projects in whatever
areas we need him. John
Biondolillo’s also been incredibly
involved with Jem, working really
closely with her booking agent,
Chip Hooper, and has just been
tenacious in what he’s trying to get
done. I think it’s really paid off.
As our personnel grows, so
does our ability to tap into other
avenues of exposure. One thing
John has really gone after is the
world of licensing; as a result,
with Jem just being conducive
to that, we’ve had tremendous
licensing opportunities brought
to us primarily through him.
What is Coran and Dave’s
contribution these days?
Chris: Everybody’s pretty
involved. Again, I work in Charlottesville with Coran so I see him
every day and he’s just one of the
most brilliant people I’ve ever
met; I love working for him.
Like Michael and I said, one
of us will take the lead on an
artist but the ability to go over
and run through something with
Coran and pick his brain or
look at it from a different angle
is undoubtedly a productive
exercise. He’s just an amazing
resource, a total team player.
He’s a great part of the label.
And all four of us – now Bruce
as well – it’s always been A&R by
committee. We’ve never signed
a band unless all the partners
gave a very enthusiastic thumbs
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2004-2005 Edition
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up, and that’s sort of been the
only criteria: an uncompromising passion for each artist.
Dave is certainly a part of it.
I think Dave has a clear vision
of what this label is and what he
wants it to be. Therefore he’s very
involved in all our signings.
on Ramen noodles and on
someone’s couch for the last
year, struggling and gutting it
out, but I like to think we have
a decent success rate and that
we can make things happen that
some of the larger labels can’t.
Michael: And, obviously, his exposure to the press and his ability
to expose new artists on tour or
in the press is a huge asset. Again,
as Chris was saying, everybody’s
involved in the A&R process
and when bands are in the studio,
Dave wants to be in the loop about
what’s going on and hearing about
how things are coming along.
Specifically, what do you mean
by “betting on the back end”?
Do you catch artists before
the bidding wars or are you
in the thick of it?
Michael: I don’t think there’s a
label out there that doesn’t try to
get on board with an artist early.
It’s obviously in every label’s best
interest. Hopefully, what artists
find refreshing about us is that
we’re honest and we’ll sit down
and say, “Look, you guys are going to be in a position to basically
dictate the terms of your deal and
that will probably include a big
upfront check from the majors.”
We can’t play that game at the
level of a major and an insane
bidding war. We’re not going to
write million dollar checks. But
what we try and convey, first of
all, is that no one here is leaving;
everyone here has a very vested
interest in the success of each
artist. We can’t afford to throw
something against the wall
and see if it sticks, and we can
be creative in our deals.
We’ll bet on the back end
if they’re willing to come
along with us and do it. I think
although we can’t necessarily
afford to compete on the front
end, I think we can win on the
back end, and that comes down
to an artist’s personal preference
or their vision.
I can’t fault someone for wanting to take a big check because
they’re behind on rent and living
Michael: We’re more artist
friendly in the details of the deal.
We’re much more upfront and
we can be much more flexible
on some of the policies that the
majors are unbending on. And
we like to think of it as more
of a partnership than owning
someone’s creative soul for the
next seven albums.
What are ATO’s views on the
digital realm and its upcoming
role?
Chris: I think it’s still being
explored for us. I wish I could
say that we are groundbreaking
and invented downloading.
We’re definitely studying and
staying abreast of everything. Our
catalog is available online and has
been there for a while, and we’re
starting to look at more creative
deals with our artists in order to
take advantage of what’s available
and what can be turned around.
At this point I think the value
of the label is unquestioned in
promoting and marketing releases
and, again, digitally what it’s done
for us and our bands has just
created more opportunities with
obviously many more to come.
Does Big Hassle, next door,
handle a lot of your clients?
Michael: They do work some
of our projects, but it’s not an
automatic thing. We build a
perfect team for each project by
hiring independents to do a lot
of things for us and be part of the
team for a particular project.
With that said, if Big Hassle
has the passion we like of our
teammates, they work the project.
Sometimes it’s not their thing,
and that’s great, and we go to the
publicist who is feeling it. But
it’s worked out great from an
office environment and just from
a business perspective.
Chris: They’re an amazing public-
ity company and we’re about to
put out a phenomenal live record
from North Mississippi Allstars.
(Big Hassle’s) Ken Weinstein
worked two Allstar records
before we signed the band, so
it’s just what Michael said: going
where the passion is and the
right person for the job, and very
frequently that’s them.
Does ATO offer tour support?
Michael: Looking at bands we’ve
worked with, I think that’s where
we’ve spent the largest percentage
of our marketing dollars. We certainly think of it as a marketing
tool. It’s where we’ve come from.
Our philosophy is that an
amazing live performance does
a hell of a lot more than an ad in
a newspaper. Not to say we don’t
do both but I think the best way
to sell a band is to go out there
and blow people’s minds.
Chris: We’re drawn to bands where
a big part of the equation is that
they’re phenomenal live. Again,
not only do I love the records
we put out but I love going to see
every single band on our label
play live. In turn, we found all of
them have success on the road.
We’re pretty confident in every
case artists will work themselves
out of the tour support situation
if they’re in it.
Tour buy-ons go all the way
down to the club level. Have
you ever been involved with
one?
Michael: Nope. I think we’re fortu-
nate enough to have bands that
other artists are really psyched to
bring out as support acts because
they genuinely love our bands. Or,
our bands are in a position to tour
on their own from fairly early days.
Chris: There’s a guy on our label,
a South African, Vusi Mahlasela.
When we were having formative
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Where was John Mayer
professionally when you
started working with him?
he ws stand in with ATO’s Be n K
weller ,
CORAN CAPSHAW (3rd from L) and Dave M
Maatt
tth
Kw
Mii ssissip pi Al l stars and Jem (R) at the Triple A Summit at Boulder, Colo.’s
Nor th M
Fox The atre in 2003.
discussions with Matthews about
forming the label over eggs back
in Charlottesville, Matthews used
to say, “We will be a successful
label one day if we release a Vusi
Mahlasela record.”
Michael and I didn’t know
who that was. It was one of Dave’s
heroes from South Africa, and he
was a strong political force in the
revolution against apartheid.
But he was also a phenomenal
songwriter and musician. We had
to support him the first few times
over here but now he’s touring
the world and touring the States
and making great money through
his live career. We’re not going
to break the bank selling world
music but we certainly are as
passionate about Vusi as anyone
on our label, and it’s been nice to
be out there promoting his career
and helping him develop that live
side that can benefit him.
Michael, along with
John Mayer, you manage
a newcomer named Ray
Lamontagne, who is making
a lot of noise. How did you
run into this guy?
Michael: Basically, via his pub-
lisher, Chrysalis, who was sending his music out to people and
setting up performances.
I saw him perform and I just
knew I wanted to be involved at
some level with him.
There were a lot of managers
interested; there were a lot of labels involved – that sort of thing.
But we had a couple good meetings and sort of hit it off. Since
that point, it’s been great because
I’ve been able to turn people on
to him and the response has been
really strong so far.
Not knowing what was going
to happen at radio, I’ve always
just said people were going to
sell Ray’s first 100,000 records
because I knew how I felt about
it and I don’t feel like I was any
different than most people and
their tastes. I think people are
going to hear it, react to it and
want to turn other people on
to it.
But, fortunately, AAA radio
has really embraced Ray’s single
and it’s off to a fantastic start,
which I think is only going to
expedite the process.
And his live performance
is riveting and we’re just going
to continue to tour. He has a wife
and two kids so it’s not going to
be a situation where he’s on the
road 10 months of the year, but
I think it’s all about the right
dates at the right time and the
right places, and really trying
to get him out and expose him
to people. That’s just going to
increase the enthusiasm about
him.
Before Ray, I was content managing John. That’s been an amazing experience with an amazing
artist and I can’t even quantify
how much I’ve learned through
the process. With Ray it was just
something that, after hearing
him, I wanted to be a part of.
Again, John Alagia brought him
to my attention. Someone asked if
John Alagia is on my holiday card
list, and I responded, “Yes, he is.”
At the time, Mayer had not
started recording his first album.
He had recorded and produced
and manufactured something
independently but he was just
selling his own CDs.
John and his attorney, Reid
Hunter, were shopping him. He
was without a manager and just
really wanted help. And, having
just started the label, I said I
couldn’t commit on a level that a
manager needs to be committed
but I would certainly help him
as much as possible.
So, I helped negotiate his Aware/
Columbia deal and put him in
touch with Scott Clayton, his agent
(at Creative Artists Agency). Scott
actually came to me because he
was interested and I had the two of
them meet. I just helped assemble
the team and, as we started to
expand here, I realized I could
commit at the level I needed to.
Did you help make Marty
Diamond’s introduction to Ray?
Ray had meetings with labels,
managers and agents before I
became his manager, so then it
was just a very difficult process
because everyone I considered
to be the best in the industry
was interested in Ray.
It was a
difficult process
to put the team
together, on a
personal level.
David Gray, My Morning Jacket
and Ben Kweller, are joint ventured with the label.
It happened during the course
of the David Gray release when
it came to a point when Chris
and I looked at each other and
said, “We could either hire a
national staff and go for this or
take this opportunity to learn
from something that’s already
in existence and use it to our
advantage.” So, we did the latter
and through our relationships
in existence with DMB and with
Hugh Surratt, Steve Ralbovsky,
Richard Sanders and more
recently Richard Palmese,
Charles Goldstuck and Clive
Davis we have become really, really strong as we’ve put more artists into the venture.
They’ve been a huge asset
to us and our experiences
and our ability to have longer
arms than we had on our
own.
Chris: Creatively, I love what
ATO stands for and the work
that we do but I’m very grateful
to be able to go to RCA and
talk to Hugh, talk to Richard,
talk to Lou Robinson – all the
people in different departments.
We all work with Ben, David
and My Morning Jacket in
a real partnership manner.
They’ll obviously help us
with any of our acts and now
with the RCA / J Records
merger, it’s almost another
layer. s
Anything
we haven’t
touched upon?
Michael: We
wanted to talk
about our joint
venture with
RCA where
three of our
acts, namely
DAVID GRAY SIGNS with ATO in 1999. L-R: Gray manager Rob
Holde n , Mi ch ael , Gray and Chr is.
2004-2005 Edition
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